can we at least achieve one thing and one thing only? for gearbox to recognize that zane does no damage in FFYL and it is a big oversight.
all of the zane’s damage skills are conditional here is what happens in ffyl
your confident competence is not active at 0
your synchronicity if you have barrier on it automatically goes down leaving you with the half assuming your other AS is up so best case you get 50%
your kill skills all deactivate once you hit FFYL (your main source of damage)
violent momentum since you move like a slug in ffyl you can’t even get ads starfe kind of dmg from this
gearbox please give us ability do get up when downed. the most popular solution suggested million times has been to have 1 stack of kill skills activate when you go down.
unless you have old-U there is no way you are getting up in higher mayhem even a trash mob will not take damage from only ~50% gun dmg capability. people have to resort to anoints like urad to have any kind of damage in ffyl.
@flightx3aa yo thicc do you know if this is in the mind of anyone in gbx team? not sure if you talked to anyone about this, we need your thicc voice mane.
Honestly, I never have this issue in M10 endgame. I routinely run Maliwan Takedown and SS and rarely go into FFYL, let alone die.
That being said, your calculations are correct, but just because it takes a little more work to get out of FFYL, doesn’t mean they need to make it easier.
Zane is the highest skill cap character in the game. There is a reason Amara is so popular, and that’s because (like every siren before her), she is the Borderlands easy button. Personally, I don’t want Zane to follow her lead. I like it when the game is challenging.
oh buddy please of course you do not go down with seein dead and barrier or clone healing you but when you go down it is not a little more work. it is next to impossible that is the point there is nothing challenging about playing zane right now with seein dead and double barrel there is negative levels of any kind of challenge it has nothing to do with the core design oversight. making zane more ffyl capable would not change just about anything about zane being “high skill ceiling”
I still don’t understand how you’re having trouble getting out of fight for your life. Are you using a Magnificent or something? Haha.
But seriously, ever since BL1, it’s common practice to keep a FFYL gun in one of your four slots. Something like a hellwalker or a backburner. Anything you like, so long as it does a lot of damage in a short time. Other than that, maybe Zane isn’t for you.
Zane’s base damage isn’t high enough. I know I’ve struggled (without using Seein’ Dead, but still using a Kill Skill build with Executor) with a Hellwalker on M6, nevermind M10 (scaling issues aside). His damage drops off of a cliff (and the Hellwalker in particular is reliant on not getting a shielded enemy, which though it can eat through, it does so a lot slower).
You talk of a skill cap, this isn’t anything to do with skill. You could be the most skilled player alive, but once you’re in FFYL you don’t have a realistic chance to come back. The damage just isn’t there. You not going into FFYL isn’t a counterargument against Zane being comparatively weak compared to all other VHs in FFYL. Because Zane is balanced around Kill Skill uptime and bonuses. Which he doesn’t get. It’s a design flaw, plain and simple.
oh ye man having an overpowered gun with urad is surely a solution ha how did i not think about it.
zane is not for me? what kind of statement is that i know zane inside out and roundabout i play zane 80% of my time if not more and i am pretty sure i play him because i like him. how do you decide zane is not for me lol. haha zane bad in ffyl it is just nof rosome people man.
the thread is literally saying zane is bad in ffyl and you said it is, what are you trying to say on top of that? that you can overcome the bad design? yes you can that is not a point.
Double downer shield. If your in a area with tough enemies and you think you might go down, slap it on. That’s what I used when I first started trying to get through the takedown.
Maybe you’re not far enough down the Survivor tree on your Guardian Ranks. The last two make FFYL cake. I don’t know, I’m just not having the same experience that you are. Might be your gear or your builds, I can’t say for sure, but I don’t touch urad, not my style. I have all Guardian Rank skills unlocked. I’m trying to help you guys out here. Best suggestion is to check those Guardian Rank skills. They make FFYL less of an issue.
first of all i used to have maxed out guardian rank and since i lost my saves i still have 100 points per each tree. i do not need help mate :d you seem to be confused about what we are saying. weather or not guardian rank or specific op guns helps the situation we are talking about design flow. i do not ever die on my seein dead zane and i if i ever die on my conductor or executor zane i can easily second wind off of drone rangers (which is the point you would make for how easy ffyl is ). on zane generally it is very hard to go down. but we are not talking about this.
we are talking about what happens when you go down and regardless of who you are you will go down and you will have no gun damage from your skill tree. this is what is being said. the point is when zane is down his design does not give him near enough gun damage to get up. you can dance circles around this issue but it won’t go away it does not matter if you get infinite down time we are talking about character, not guardian ranks not anointments not specific items. we are talking zane and his damage in ffyl compared to any other VH.
to make it easy for you to pictures this imagine a zane in ffyl but he has no guardian rank on and no anointments on the weapon. what does character have going for him in that situation. GR and urad and anointment generally are for everyone this has nothing to do with zane’s design mate.
FFYL is simple to get out of for every character, but the point of the OP is that Zane has it the hardest because at the moment he has no damage boosts active in FFYL.
Yes, you already have a barrier that negates most damage in a 360* radius, and a clone that can proc lifesteal, and GR that makes FFYL last forever and give a damage buff. So what can it hurt to just give Zane a bit of passive damage when he goes down? As you say, getting out of FFYL is easy, so what is the big deal with making it more fair for Zane? There are already so many tools to trivialize FFYL that giving Zane some passive damage to make it a bit easier for him won’t do anything to make the situation any worse than it is, and if you go down as little as you say then it won’t matter to you in the slightest regardless.
furthermore there is an obscure importance to this. once real endgame starts and real 1life challenges with proper rule sets are engaged, chances are there will be no GR as a standard for gameplay (it already is for many people) and also could be no anoints or restricted use of certain anoints. and as a prolific permadeath player i would like to play a character that is not death sentenced on a single down occasion when in endgame.
As of this moment, there is nothing you can do to make him a better VH in FFYL. He is not designed with any passive damage that is active when he is downed.
If I may ask, why would this be a big deal to anyone? In light of having 1 minute FFYLs, extra damage from GR, and having tons of damage negation and life steal to completely avoid FFYL in the first place, as well as having chars like FL4K and Amara that have get out of jail free cards in FFYL, what difference would some extra damage while downed make? I don’t play Zane but this seems like a non-issue in both directions, however I can definitely see the logic in the OP since, unless there is more passive damage in the 4th tree, Zane doesn’t have much of any.
i am actually but that is also beside the point this is not called whining this is a suggestion but you are clearly a bit too young to separate pride from point of argument. you can clearly see 3 different people articulate what the issue is and somehow still miss the point.
). on zane generally it is very hard to go down. but we are not talking about this.