Money Shot and Dahl/Jakobs Sniper Rifles

Borderlands 2 Salvador the Gunzerker
#1

Yesterday I took my first foray into UVHM difficulty (went up to rescued the Firehawk - will bring the other characters to 50 before continuing ) .

Since this is a sal leaning on 9/5 money shot (lousy green raider COM >> legendary berserker) with no Moxxy magic yet (I used a lvl 50 Bad Touch in the Boom Boom Fight) and 2 points in brown (hard to kill and incite for messing with the berserker com) ADS sniping was involved at places and the not so bad results got me thinking a bit. (a lvl 48 green ornery coach gun carried most of the weight thus far, I have a blue lvl 52 one to get me further ā€¦ And a blood of the ancients and a purple adaptive shield)

Maximizing money shot abuse out of gunzerk mode is not going to work as well (you lack the mag size freedom, the free slag, the health regen, etc ā€¦) so obviously this is NOT going to be a very powerful way to build Sal.

First big thing is you need to get that mag size - none of the money shot COMs up filled to the brim but the monk COM can increase mag size significantly . (this has negative consequences on gunzerking with shotguns performance youā€™ll need one with 1 shot upped to 2).

Steady as she goes as many of Salā€™s skill points sadly is gunzerk mode only .

Dahl snipers will probably work best (are there weapon parts that make the burst longer than 3 so it would take less than 4 trigger pulls to get to your money shot round/burst ? YES Surgical Sniper drop had burst length of 5 with mag size of 6 :slight_smile: ).
Aim bellow head and the burst will climb due to recoil.
Does money shot apply to the whole burst ?! (EDIT ONLY LAST BULLET or multi-shot bullets (lascalux)) .

lascalux burst test

6078  1558707.250 Max   1503029.250 Cur  1508307.750 Prev     5278.500 Damage
   0  1558707.250 Max   1497750.750 Cur  1503029.250 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  63  1558707.250 Max   1493248.750 Cur  1498527.250 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  15  1558707.250 Max   1488203.375 Cur  1493481.875 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  63  1558707.250 Max   1483839.000 Cur  1489117.500 Prev     5278.500 Damage
   0  1558707.250 Max   1478560.500 Cur  1483839.000 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  78  1558707.250 Max   1474290.375 Cur  1479568.875 Prev     5278.500 Damage
   0  1558707.250 Max   1469011.875 Cur  1474290.375 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  62  1558707.250 Max   1464706.875 Cur  1469985.375 Prev     5278.500 Damage 
   0  1558707.250 Max   1459428.375 Cur  1464706.875 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  78  1558707.250 Max   1455135.500 Cur  1460414.000 Prev     5278.500 Damage
   0  1558707.250 Max   1449857.000 Cur  1455135.500 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  16  1558707.250 Max   1444578.500 Cur  1449857.000 Prev     5278.500 Damage 
   0  1558707.250 Max   1439300.000 Cur  1444578.500 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  63  1558707.250 Max   1435187.375 Cur  1440465.875 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  15  1558707.250 Max   1429908.875 Cur  1435187.375 Prev     5278.500 Damage
  63  1558707.250 Max   1380018.750 Cur  1430903.125 Prev    50884.375 Damage 
   0  1558707.250 Max   1329134.375 Cur  1380018.750 Prev    50884.375 Damage

Jackobs semi autos will also work due to the increased crit multiplier and better control on the money shot bullet BUT at 12 trigger pulls to 1 moneyshot the damage spike will be less relevant.

Vladoff might work - used in semi auto mode (but it would probably just be like a Jakobs with less crit)ā€¦
(locked and loaded might help draining the first part of the clip in auto mode).

OR something weirder like the Unforgiven pistol :slight_smile: // happend to have on the char and it works in a similar way. // kind of slow ROF

I donā€™t have enough experience with Sal and borderlands 2 to prototype a build based on this yet ā€¦but I feel a not overly challenging build could be made around this. (probably lotsa brown since so few of his skills work outside of gunzerk)

Edit: also smaller mag size might work depending on burst size. 10 mag size with size 3 burst means 3 bursts and the 4-th trigger pull has the (slightly less powerful) money shot where you aim it.

DOES money shot multiply the BEE amp damage ? (it should :slight_smile: ) .

#4

Amplify damage doesnā€™t work on your offhand weapon.

If you really wish to capitilize on money shot and be stupid broken, then look for some pimpernel+duurp build on the web.

In fact you may have any slag pimpernel of any level in your offhand+a rocket launcher with high base damage in your main hand to roll over the entire game even without lifesteal guns.

In theory the smaller magazine you have in your main dps weapon the better with the exception of pimpernel/sawbar/flakker(does it work like pimpernel in the offhand?); it is better for as long as your gun can shoot at least two times.

It is due to the fact that money shot damage is calculated based on the magazine size of your main hand weapon.

Also, i think that deputy build with two shot shotguns like hydra/trinqueta(?donā€™t remember how it spells) is still capable of dishing out some insane damage even outside gunzerk.

They are not optimal, but they are still capable of oneshotting slagged enemies even outside gunzerk.

#5

this post is (mostly) about out of gunzerk aim down scope sniper rifle use . Such a build would use gunzerk mostly for healing and ammo regen (for emergencies / between engagements )ā€¦and maybe some shotgun to the face in extreme cases :slight_smile: .

#6

Then it would be fun to see, if it actually works.

I think pitchfork would be great for this build.+switching for hoarder mod for ammo regen, while in gunzerk.

About the bee interaction I am not sure(i think it doesnā€™t), because It feels like a niche shield for sal, but if you are not playing in your face, then why not? Not that you will actually hit the damage cap with that build and you are not going to rely on inconceivable.

P.S. Also you want to aim for 12 bullets in the magazine. Saying it just in case. So, feel to the brim might not be a good thing to skill up, which kinda means that the middle tree is in counter synergy to the idea of your build. Which means that it would be a good idea to ignore it; i will look it up.

#7

Thinking about it you might want to make your gunzerk with longer(!) cooldown not skilling up cd/duration related skills for keep it piping hot bonus.

I dont think you need to skill up anything in your middle tree for this build, if you are playing with pitchfork or you already got 12 ammo in the magazine.

You can try to pull of some next level thing with downig your hp to 1 with a hoplite abuse and be an ultimate glass cannon with 5 points in just got real.

That might be one of the dumbest builds I have ever seen, but it might work if you are a careful ninja, who dodges bullets. http://bl2skills.com/gunzerker.html#550521551510000000000005550155501

You like get 4 pitchforks and start shooting people in hope they wonā€™t hit you.

Instead of just got real you may want to pick up some regen skills(which means no hoplite abuse), but just got real then becomes a bit pointless.

#8

Iā€™m no expert, but usually abusing Moneyshot works by putting a large mag gun in the main hand and a small mag gun in the off hand because the game only uses the main hand mag size to determine your Moneyshot bonus. That powers much of Salā€™s OP nature.

If youā€™ve got questions about Salvador and how to build/equip him Iā€™d highly recommend going to the authority around these parts. If you post in this thread here :point_down:

DeputyChuck's Gunzerking management class

you may get some helpful advice for your build concept. Post your build (current/target) and gear, along with notes for playstyle and youā€™ll get advice from the most helpful folks on the interweb. (And Keep It Piping Hot is active anytime you proc Get Some, so building down Rampage to Get Some and Yippe Kay Ay is still probably a good idea.)

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#9

guys I know how money shot works :slight_smile: (except the weirdness of inconceivable chains) . Really . And this is not about exploiting it to its MAXIMUM potential ( 2 + 12 ) .

This is about NOT using gunzerk for combat much - making a cowardly long range Sal that only uses 1 ONE weapon at a time and ADS .

#10

I wasnā€™t trying to condescend, and if it came off that way Iā€™m sorry. I was looking at:

because abusing Moneyshot usually implies offhand shenanigans.

This is why I suggested that link. There are ā€œnormalā€ questions there, but if youā€™re looking to do something different the OP in that thread is @DeputyChuck, and he can help you find a way to get the most out of your concept. Either way I like the idea of your concept because Salā€™s ā€œin your faceā€ style is somewhat counterintuitive for me and Iā€™d be curious to see how far you could roll this concept.

#11

I havenā€™t mentioned vladoff snipers but some of them are probably the best candidates of emptying the 12 round clip fastest. A elemental one that uses 2 ammo per shot even faster (literally trigger pull) but ā€¦ the splash component is not monified ā€¦

Iā€™m not working on this atm ā€¦ Iā€™m bringing all chars to lvl 50 ā€¦ still a few to go ā€¦ I might come back to it laterā€¦

#12

I did this with my first 6 too, and Iā€™m glad I did. It allowed me to have a basic handle on each character before starting the climb for that last 22 skill points, and that made a difference. Like learning a new language makes learning the next one easier, you can absolutely say the same for the toons in BL2.

You mean Moloko Etech snipers, right? I think that several time trials records are held by Moloko Sals. Iā€™ve never used one outside of Gunzerking, but dual wielding Molokos is a boatload of fun. Right up there with dual wielding Droogs and Lyudas.

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#13

On discord the other night i had the idea of using the pitchfork(dahl sniper) with a hoarder sal setup. Might be able to make something like that work

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#14

Ladies and gentlemen: I give you our new Dahlvador candidate!

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#15

Go for it. I for one would be interested in that. In fact, I do have a Sal sitting at level 50 right now. A non-zerker zerker might be an interesting thing to try. And I do have quite a few hand-me-downs I can play with.

Interested to know what folks would suggest as a level 50 starting point for this.

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#16

Dahlvador never excluded GZ so I canā€™t draw from previous. Just about to start work but will amuse myself pondering this today.

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#17

I think the skill build for this is pretty obvious.

http://bl2skills.com/gunzerker.html#550501551510000000000005501100000

or do this, if you feel like you donā€™t have enough survivability

http://bl2skills.com/gunzerker.html#550001551510000000000005504102000

2 pitchforks+slagging weapon+utility.

Hoarder mod is a must for more ammo, but you always have to switch it for choatic evil monk, when you feel like you need more dps(I think there may be better mod outhere, but it like wonā€™t make a huge difference). Auspicious rider for speed, if you feel like you have enough damage and hp.

Switch between bee/antagonist/sham/tortoise is pretty obvious. I think even underleveld sham would do better than most of the shields in the game, since you will need more ammo.

I would get a simple elemental damage relic not the bone, because you want your gunzerk on cooldown to be as long as possible for additional damage. Or it would be like the same thing to get stockpile relic to use hoarder less or if you donā€™t have one. Allegiance dahl relic may be useful for bosses. Also, I have no idea how fire rate affects the delays between bursts, but I think it is not that important, because ammo consumption of pitchfork, so you want to maximize the value of your single burst.

Ideally you want a slag singularity or transfusion, since no grog or just get a 4 slot grog with chain lightning.

In slots it would be something like:
Pitchfork
Pitchfork
Slagging weapon
Grog/Ladyfist for crit swaps

With autoloader you donā€™t care for reload speed, and you got swap speed bonus in quick draw. Which means the middle tree is completely pointless. Only may be for 5 points in inconcievable with rough rider for moneyshot chains, but i think you will get more reliable dps with bee due to using pitchfork; I may be biased towards skills that are based on RNG, but rough rider money shot chains will probably deal more damage in boss fights.

This game is so complicated it baffles Stanford scientists. For titans of pondering into complexities.

#18

To be fair to the Ivy Leagues, most of the problems they are trying to solve do not reduce to ā€œshoot things until theyā€™re deadā€. Which might explain why Zed doesnā€™t have a real doctorateā€¦

Unexpectedly off early today, so Iā€™m just firing up BL2 to see where my TVHM Sal is at.

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#19

I must be a genius then :joy:

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#20

You would be surpsired, but even Elon Musks once in a while contemplates on the efficiency of cyber murdering.

They are people too.

#22

Tried it, it works. :slight_smile: You need a really good trigger finger. Lyuda was still slightly better IMO. And the skullmasher delivered about similar results too if you were wondering, but meshes better with hoarder setups as it consumes 1 ammo per shot.

You donā€™t even need a hoarder COM to make it work :slight_smile:

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#23

If you arenā€™t going to Gunzerk then Keep it Piping Hot wonā€™t be active with this setup, so it would be 5 wasted points. I think that Get Some would solve that, but I donā€™t know off the top of my head if it works when your gunzerk is ready to go.

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