2 players, all 6 classes each, Duo Star

Borderlands 2 BL2 General Discussion
#1

When I search for CoOp or Duo pairs, I get a bunch of threads focused on ‘Best’; and most of the best include a siren or two.

My Wife and I have created all 6 classes (each) and have reached sanctuary. We want to level up each class together in the duo fashion. (we also have some duplicate classes for solo play).

I am asking the community for your opinion on duo possibilities (and if so inclined focused trees). Feel free to answer all of the slots, or just the ones you know of.

I’ve stolen the shots from a Nexus mod that I’m sure stole it from somewhere else.
I’ve stolen the ratings from Gulfwulf, originally from Chuck80.

spoiler[/spoiler]Terrible: Won’t make it through UVHM.

spoiler[/spoiler]Sub-par: Combos that require specific coordination or trees/items to function.

spoiler[/spoiler]Average: Combos that work, nothing great or weak about them.

spoiler[/spoiler]Great: Combos that would flow great with each other.

spoiler[/spoiler]Outstanding: Favorite Combos.

Snazy Image to go here.

imageAxton the Commando

Great Mid Range Support

  • Axton the Commando
  • Maya the Siren
  • Salvador the Gunzerker
  • Zer0 the Assassin
  • Gaige the Mechromancer
  • Krieg the Psycho

image Maya the Siren
Even better for Long/Mid Range duos. Needs caution when paired with a stack/health duo.

  • Axton the Commando
  • Maya the Siren
  • Salvador the Gunzerker
  • Zer0 the Assassin (With Support)
  • Gaige the Mechromancer
  • Krieg the Psycho (Caution on Healing)

image Salvador the Gunzerker
May get bored with not killing for stack/blood classes. Tanks pretty well.

  • Axton the Commando
  • Maya the Siren
  • Salvador the Gunzerker
  • Zer0 the Assassin
  • Gaige the Mechromancer
  • Krieg the Psycho

image Zer0 the Assassin
Struggles with random (automatic) kill stealing.

  • Axton the Commando
  • Maya the Siren (With Support)
  • Salvador the Gunzerker
  • Zer0 the Assassin
  • Gaige the Mechromancer (Poor Deathtrap)
  • Krieg the Psycho

image Gaige the Mechromancer
Steals Kills, Poor with Distance Duos

  • Axton the Commando
  • Maya the Siren
  • Salvador the Gunzerker
  • Zer0 the Assassin
  • Gaige the Mechromancer (Poor Deathtrap)
  • Krieg the Psycho (LBT)

image Krieg the Psycho
Needs control of what dies and shields.

  • Axton the Commando
  • Maya the Siren (Limit Healing)
  • Salvador the Gunzerker
  • Zer0 the Assassin
  • Gaige the Mechromancer (LBT)
  • Krieg the Psycho
Contributers and Edits

Edit and rankings by Blutfatal.
Edit by Derch.
Edit by MaddBomber83 for refined ratings.
Edit by Adabiviak.
Edit by narfkeks.
Edit by ChemicalConundrum.
Edit by Adabiviak and Piemanlee.
Edit by nothng.
Edit by narfkeks.
Edit by sparkofleaves
Edit by MaddBomber83 for refined ratings.
Edit by MaddBomber83 adding higher resolution colors.
Edit by Blutfatal.
Edit by sparkofleaves
Edit by Maveco

Color Range

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#2

GulfWulf didn’t make that rating system.
Chuck80 did.

Also here it goes.

Krieg like solo play, he doesn’t really like co-op but is still outstanding.

Everyone else are outstanding as a duo.

That is based off statistical data and not opinion.

2 Likes
#3

Yeah, it may be better to describe certain skills or tactics that don’t play will with others than entire characters. Thoughtlock/Sub Sequence/Converge Maya with Zer0 can be rough for the Assassin, for example, but a Siren built for teamwork can be an outstanding partner for Zer0.

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#4

Some classes have more synergies with each other but they are all working as a duo pretty well. The only thing I cannot fully recommend is a duo of melee-Psychos, just cause they would steal each others kills to often, what can be a death sentence in UVHM. Still its viable with good communication between the players.
My favorite team is the Siren/Psycho-combo. Its the perfect combination of crowd-control and mass-destruction. The first time Converge and Bloodsplosion combine into a gigantic chain of exploding bodies, you two will love it.
Axton is a great teamplayer too. His turret/s as distraction and slag-source is/are of infinite value in every team-composition.
O and yeah, every melee-character needs good teamwork with a character like Maya or Axton, when they are using converge or the Nuke or any other knock-around-skill, cause these can mess up the melee-character’s timing pretty badly.

1 Like
#5

Maya and everyone (including another Siren) is the best combo imho. She is support and her main builds will work with everyone, not just low-DPS, tank healer builds. Res is the big game changer of course, but Sweet Release is also really useful as a transfusion grenade on every phase lock kill. There’s also Elated and Restoration (though I normally only spec for this if I’m playing with a Krieg or if I’m doing a tank healer build for a Raid Boss team). Phase lock holds stuff in place for ppl to shoot and is an extra slagging tool (Ruin) along with a singularity grenade (Converge). I agree Axton is also quite useful with double turrets to distract/slag. Sal is a good partner, just because of his DPS and ability to absorb damage takes some of the heat off the other player.

1 Like
#6

Yeup! I’m sure each character has a class mod or certain tree that would compliment any other class. What I’m looking for is those synergies with each other. I don’t want to be stepping on each other’s toes. Even classes that don’t synergize well but won’t counteract each other would be an Average rating.

I’ll modify the ratings a bit to be more clear.

Awesome, this is what I was asking in the OP for any specific tree combo that was needed. Thank you.[quote=“ChemicalConundrum, post:5, topic:1539306”]
Maya and everyone (including another Siren) is the best combo imho.
[/quote]

Thank you!

#7

Depending on how Krieg is built, a Harmony-focused Siren can apparently be problematic (because she’ll keep trying to get his health up over some level, which is needed for one of his skills). Any Psycho players care to describe this?

Deathtrap with sniper or melee Zer0 can be weird too, because Deathtrap will be running around the battlefield stirring up enemies when Zer0 is trying to line up his shot/skills. Also: Buck Up on Deathtrap with melee Zer0 is borderline trolling if Zer0 is trying to use a Roid shield - Deathtrap will keep trying to restore it whenever Roid damage is up. :laughing:

3 Likes
#8

A nurse Maya could cause problems for melee krieg because he needs to be at or below 33% health to activate release the beast. Which fully restores his health and gives him more melee damage

1 Like
#9

in my opinion, maya sal is the best combo. because of phaselock and sal’s long range damage, most fights won’t involve the enemy shooting at all. phaselock, sal 1 hit kills, sub sequence, 1 hit kill, sub sequence.

maya with a shamfleet makes an excellent healer and does respectable damage, but rarely needs to fire her weapon. sal can usually kill mobs with 1 mag at op 8, the enemies live about 10 seconds and spend most of it migrating to a phaselock. this is due to sal’s independence of kill skills (ie money shot).

for raiding, maya sal works great if sal tanks. maya revives a tank that’s already hard to take down makes it decently robust. maya can still handle mobs fairly easily while sal has always been known for his efficient raid boss tactics.

we found that zero’s ca stacks and krieg’s health management are not quite as effective and results in less efficiency. their other problem is that they can’t compete in damage to sal, who will eventually take kills he doesn’t need (sal can snowball with nklo, however). sal and maya are also competent at sniper range. without ca stacks, zero struggles and krieg isn’t relevant. gaige suffers similarly without consistent anarchy stacking strategies at sniper distances. axton is a great team player at medium distances for raid bosses due to his shield, but we found in actual game play that another maya or another sal is actually better.

also, sal generates his own ammo and doesn’t require time spent collecting ammo. shamfleeting has a net gain in ammo and maya is no exception, resulting in less time spent ammo collecting.

1 Like
#10

Gaige has some problematics with other classes. These are for example but not limited to:

  • recharching allie’s shields by buck-up on a roid-shield-user
  • DT steals kills needed for second winds
  • Sharing is caring with a Love Thumper kills friend and foe alike with explosive novas
  • Anarchy-pre-stacking needs time while your teammates may have to wait for you

Krieg:

  • Bloodsplosion can steal kills at an extraordinary rate
  • Krieg as a melee-character can interfere with crowd-control-skills like converge or Nuke
  • Grenade-Krieg is a walking apocalypse for enemies and teammates in range
  • sarcasm: Krieg kills so fast, other classes that need kills as Setup (Salvador, Gaige) loose potential

Salvador:

  • he needs the kills to keep his Gunzerking going, so he can be somewhat problematic with other high-dps-classes
  • like Krieg, he steals kills extremely easily
  • his close-range-combat-style could hinder melee-classes (not too much, though)

In my opinion, these 3 are the ones with the most Anti-synergistic skills/playstyles and seem to tend more to solo-play than the other three. Though, in a well-rounded team with good teamwork, they are just as useful as the other classes. They are dps-oriented for the most part, though Gaige needs a lot of Anarchy for this.
All three of them are fast-paced and profit from good reflexes, but aren’t the best for support usually. Their in-your-face-playstyle has the problem, that it leaves the player with little time to make decisions, so its harder to think about your teammates’ needs.

Sal-Edit: Sal can tank pretty well, so he can fill two roles at once. Damage-dealer and moxx-tank. That’s one of the two main-reasons (2nd being money-shot-chains) that as good as every raiding-team has at least one Sal.

I hope it helps

1 Like
#11

LBT Gaige goes well with Hellborn Krieg. Gaige’s Catalyst mod increases Krieg’s DoT healing and thus his tankihg potential. My friend’s Krieg doesn’t have to stop and switch weapons for shield stripping, the shields are already goneDT seeves as a third target to divide the enemy’s attention, letting Krieg tag them with DoT while taking a little less fire. In turn, walking fireball provides extra aggro between DT recharges. Conversely, as narfkeks pointed out, Anarchy Gaige is not much of a team player due to having to compete for kills.

As various people noted, Maya works well with almost any other vault hunter

1 Like
#12

I’ve updated the OP with the information provided. Occasionally I’ll update if more people give their thoughts on the matter. Thank you for your help!

Thank you all!

Edit and rankings by Blutfatal.
Edit by Derch.
Edit by MaddBomber83 for refined ratings.
Edit by Adabiviak.
Edit by narfkeks.
Edit by ChemicalConundrum.
Edit by Adabiviak and Piemanlee.
Edit by nothng.
Edit by narfkeks.
Edit by sparkofleaves
Edit by MaddBomber83 for refined ratings.

#13

Players do the same thing way more often.
Axtons turrets do too[quote=“narfkeks, post:10, topic:1539306”]

  • Sharing is caring with a Love Thumper kills friend and foe alike with explosive novas
    [/quote]

Everyone can do this, not just DT.[quote=“narfkeks, post:10, topic:1539306”]

  • Bloodsplosion can steal kills at an extraordinary rate
    [/quote]
    IF he gets a kill. There are times he cant get a kill at all because there are 4 players.

Chuck is also a community badass.
Honestly the title means nothing more than “oh look we did something more than argue and posted something helpful once then our name was drawn out of a hat”

3 Likes
#14

Because Sal typically tanks through DPS, he may have trouble pausing shooting long enough to pick up a teammate. In contrast, Krieg can Redeem the Soul instantly even if he stole a second wind kill. Or in Hellborn Krieg’s case, he’s usually close enough that he can get to the teammate in time.

Personally, I’ve found DT is more likely to attempt Buck Up on a downed teammate than steal a second wind kill :stuck_out_tongue: DT also doesn’t quite have the damage output of Zer0 or Krieg. Sal is more likely to steal kills

I would put Maya/Zer0 at Great rather than Outstanding because of Convergence disrupting the latter’s sniping. For Maya/Axton, Phaselock/Convergence would presumably help both Axton’s turret and Torgue gyro jets.

Sal’s Hoarder mod is nice for a sniper Zer0

1 Like
#15

Krieg can be made not that shi† in co-op with Hellborn’s kill-skill independence and Redeem the Soul’s last-second-insta-trade-places-then-RtB-once-achieving-2nd-wind; With some decent health-regen from BBB + EEmpathy you can keep drawing all the area’s avaliable aggro away from your amp-scrub partners.

… and also the post above mine wich is pretty much the same ._.

2 Likes
#16

[quote=“Maveco, post:15, topic:1539306”][/quote]

[quote=“sparkofleaves, post:14, topic:1539306”][/quote]

[quote=“Blutfatal, post:13, topic:1539306”][/quote]

Thank you all for the updates. Based on your feedback I’m not seeing any orange left. I also increased the number of colors. (from 5, to 41)
Going back to the start of this thread:[quote=“Blutfatal, post:2, topic:1539306”]
Krieg like solo play, he doesn’t really like co-op but is still outstanding.

Everyone else are outstanding as a duo.
[/quote]
Also Blutfatal, I’m one step closer to not getting another hammer on how to label people. :grinning:

#17

[quote=“maddbomber83, post:16, topic:1539306”]
Thank you all for the updates. Based on your feedback I’m not seeing any orange left. I also increased the number of colors. (from 5, to 41)Going back to the start of this thread:
[/quote]Maya is outstanding with everyone. Bar none.
Only team that isn’t great together is Sal and Krieg because they both compete over kills and krieg is based off kill skills.

[quote=“maddbomber83, post:16, topic:1539306”]
Also Blutfatal, I’m one step closer to not getting another hammer on how to label people
[/quote]It’s good to be a badass, it’s just something anyone can get if you help the community enough or do something insane like that guy who proposed to his wife with a home made shield and a ring box that looked like a loot chest.

1 Like
#18

My wife would like the box (and insert many other shows/games she loves) more than another ring.

#19

My wife would like to be alive but I prefer her as my computer.

2 Likes
#20

Not even a sniper assassin paired with a melee psycho, missing every shot because of general target jittery while trying to run away/at the psycho?