Crunching numbers for effect maximization w/o BAR

Borderlands 2 Loot and Weapons
#1

Before anyone asks, I realize the following would be extremely unlikely to happen. Still I was wondering, and it’s mostly for curiosity’s sake…mostly.

That said, if points have been dumped into maximizing the relevant skills, who would have the strongest benefit from the following attributes with a blue (+6/+5) or Legendary mod with maximum effect and with benefit of their AS?:

  • Accuracy
  • Action Skill Cooldown Rate
  • Critical Damage
  • Fire Rate
  • Gun Damage
  • Health Regeneration
  • Magazine Size
  • Maximum Health

Also, do the team mods stack with each other, or onto each other?

  • with: (base) + (mod + mod + mod)
  • onto: (base + mod) +mod) + mod)
NOTE: The wiki is really outta date on some pages. For instance, I've gotten a 47%, but the page for Resourceful and Proficiency Relic each respectively state 36.4% and 44%.
#2

I’ll start the bidding with Zer0.

For the team mods… both of those formulas should wind up with the same output, since all the operators are addition? If one of those were multiplication, for example, the formula structure would make a difference.

#3

Krieg would likely win on maximum health, magazine size, and gun damage depending on the gear he was using. And maybe fire rate, but I don’t play Hellborn so I don’t know.

#4

@Adabiviak There’s at least two that I know of that involve multiplication in the process – Zero’s Shot mod, and the Alignment mods from Tina’s DLC, both of which (can) involve Critical Damage. Where else they involve them beyond (BDxCD)+BD is a bit beyond me.

#5

I might go looking up relevant numbers here in a few days, for now, I will make some off-hand guesses:
Accuracy: Zer0
Action Skill Cooldown Rate: Maya?
Critical Damage: Zer0
Fire Rate: Salvador
Gun Damage: Krieg (if we ignore 100 Bloodlust stacks, then Axton?)
Health Regeneration: Salvador
Magazine Size: Krieg (2nd: Axton with ARs, otherwise ?)
Maximum Health: Krieg

#6

[quote=“Frightning, post:5, topic:1309283”]if we ignore 100 Bloodlust stacks[/quote]Yeah, preferably looking at it w/o stacks, just for an even comparison.

#7

Without stacks Krieg only wins in maximum health. He does do the most explosive damage, but I don’t know if he could beat out Axton for grenade damage (yes they’re different).

#8

:raising_hand: I don’t quite understand the question based on the others answers. If you’d like my input could you reexplain it please? Thanks.

#9

Axton wins cool down rate and grenade damage.
Not sure but I’d think zero would have better melee damage
Sal would still win it all just because he’s sal
Krieg has max health and healing I guess. EE + RtB full health and health on kill + Totk

1 Like
#10

@khimerakiller Basically a ground-up comparison of the VHs, looking at who can get the best numbers between the VHs…

  • with a blue (+6/+5) or Legendary mod
  • (preferably) without their Action Skill
  • without stacks
  • without BAR
#11

Thanks. What about kill skills, gear besides coms, and gun type/specific set up stuff (I.E Overload, Killing Bl0w, ect…)?

#12

With the exception of the cooldown (I would think a TL Maya would take the cake here), this 100%

Since Deathmark and Ambush are multiplicative, Zero would get way better melee damage from a small additive bonus than Krieg, who doesn’t have any multiplicative melee increases as far as I know.

Sal definitely wins on fire rate.

Krieg has so much damage reduction and health skills that he wins in the max health department.

I’d say shield stats for Axton, no idea what for Gaige.

#13

Pretty sure from what I’ve heard StV is multiplicative and so is his built in multiplier that causes standard bladed weapons to be obsolete around level ~55. Those are the only 2 I know of off the top of my head, there may be more.

#14

[quote=“khimerakiller, post:11, topic:1309283, full:true”]
Thanks. What about kill skills, gear besides coms, and gun type/specific set up stuff (I.E Overload, Killing Bl0w, ect…)?[/quote]Make it as base a comparison as possible. If there isn’t stacking involved, run it.

Relevant question – kill skills can stack onto themselves, correct?

#15

No kill skills can not stack upon them selves. You simply restart the 7 second timer.

#16

[quote=“khimerakiller, post:15, topic:1309283”]No kill skills can not stack upon them selves. You simply restart the 7 second timer.[/quote]Huh, didn’t know that. Well, factor in

  • kill skills
  • Action Skills
  • shields
  • relics
#17

Just stack-less since you updated the OP.

  • Accuracy - Zero 215%
  • Action Skill Cooldown Rate - Gaige 154% (But technically Krieg and Salvador)
  • Critical Damage - Salvador 2967%
  • Fire Rate - Salvador 309%
  • Gun Damage - Salvador 16,704.2% (Just literal gun damage, no Bone, amp, or anything)
  • Actual Health Regeneration - Maya 15.4% + 11,900.9 a second (Technically everyone)
  • Magazine Size - Axton 232%
  • Maximum Health - Krieg 4,630,920

I probably f’ed up some where, but this should be good enough.

#18

@khimerakiller I was indecisive on factoring in Action Skills, and I missed shields/relics in your other post, so I’m not sure if you factored those in, but your numbers are at least something against what I got (=nada). :thumbsup:
As for stack-less, I specified that for something stable/concrete to work with that everyone can work with; as stacks are not only character-specific but relatively fluid (even Gaige’s Anarchy), they were thus excluded.

#19

Yeah I included guns and gear since you didn’t say no. Except I did not include the little Evie.

#20

I just read the wiki’s entry for the Evie, and noted the part about its cooldown exploit. We can always come back to it later if we do factor it in. Doesn’t need to be said that it would be minus the exploit, which would completely kill the formula.

Also, for error-checking your math, what skills/gear did you factor for those numbers?

Found this for the mods: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1m2xGD2A1tkdp4ZrAZn5a8RYdSq1_FXgwNIxOiwVS2Sg/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=0