Stocks on Hyperion shotguns

Borderlands 2 Loot and Weapons
#1

This subject is meant for min-maxers, if you’re a relatively new player, you might be confused by what follows.
Just gonna draw the attention of a few experts here: @Derch, @Sljm, @Exotek, @Hoyle4, @khimerakiller, @Wingsday, @Gulfwulf, @Blutfatal, @Afro_Samurai, @BookEmDano (I’m probably forgetting a few, sorry)

Ever since Blut wrote his DDD thing on stocks, everyone has been chanting the same song: For shotguns, Hyperion stock is the best, except on Hyperion shotguns where both the Torgue and Hyperion stocks are good for different reasons (due to the Hyperion gimmick of reverse recoil)
That thread is about Hyperion shotguns specifically.

Reference: http://imgur.com/gallery/8xsH0

The Hyperion one is liked because it has increased accuracy, but you will have to live with a recoil that goes away fast (so it’s probably the best on heavily-sustained fire guns like the Butcher)

The Torgue one takes more time to get to pinpoint accuracy (reduced recoil) But it will retain it for longer, like through the reload process. (so, it’s useful if you reload more often and/or if accuracy is important)

So picking between either is really a matter of preference and what specific gun you use. Balancing accuracy, recoil and recoil recovery.

So far so good ?

…The Jakobs stock does all 3:

  • It increases accuracy like the Hyperion one
  • it has slower recoil recovery like the Torgue
  • AND It has INCREASED recoil (meaning you will get to pinpoint faster)

On paper, the Jakobs stock is by far the best for Hyperion shotguns.
so…Why is it ignored/reviled ?
Is it because it doesn’t perform as well in-game as it should on paper ?
Is it because Blut didn’t like it personally ?
Was it just because it’s rather bad in all other cases so it was never properly tested in the case of Hyperion shotguns?

I’ve never given much thought on stocks since I farm all my gear and just getting the right grip/element/accessory is already a nightmare and a waste of time, i’m certainly not gonna farm for the right stock as well. But if its worth writing a guide on stocks, then I guess its worth answering this too right ?

I’ve had an otherwise perfect thinking drop not too long ago with a Jakobs stock…and it handled extremely well: It got to pinpoint very fast, stayed there for a long time and was very precise.

Item Finds of the Day BL2
#2

It’s been awhile since Blut and I tested the Butcher but yeah the Torgue Stock was really good on it, I don’t recall what was off with the Jakobs but that was back on 360.

I’ll do some tests on them again and refresh myself.

It’s possible we just missed it for some reason and all this time its been ignored.

1 Like
#4

Yeah, maybe :stuck_out_tongue:

#5

If I can add anything the Jakobs stock looks stupid af. Like a field hockey stick.

In the realm of TPS I’ll potato cam a video of three moon clip company men with all three stocks, they’ll have long ass mag and a long ass reloads so you can see something useful hopefully.

Maybe a Bullpup? Would faster or slower FR be more beneficial here?

1 Like
#6

Slower I guess.

#7

I could shoot until the reticle stops shrinking then reload.

#8

I did some quick testing with a Development shotgun and I have to say that the Jakob’s stock performed the worse - the damned thing kicked like a mule.

Here are the shotguns I used (all three have the Hyperion grip):

Hyperion stock:

image
2015-12-26_00001.jpg1920×1080 224 KB

Torgue stock:

image
2015-12-26_00002.jpg1920×1080 225 KB

Jakob stock:

image
2015-12-26_00003.jpg1920×1080 228 KB

A quick test on the dummy in Sanctuary:

I forgot to turn BAR off before the first gun, but I kept it on for the other two. I also don’t have Fire Fiend, but all three are non-elemental and were copies of each other save the stock. From my tests, I would never use a Jakobs stock on anything. The grips are fine, but the stocks suck.

#9

I mean as a function of the worst Recoil Hyp Shotgun, the kick might be too much, but from like a thinking/single shot perspective (ie pretty much every other usable hyp shotgun) it might be much more reasonable.

#10

It’s still going to give a higher recoil per shot than the others, Hyperion’s gimmick will invert the recoil increase/decrease functions but the magnitude will stay the same.

#11

I would never use it, because its damn ugly (except on Jakobs coach). Tbh I dont even use torgue stock on hyperion shooties for the very same reason.

#12

It is awesome to live in the world where you think you’re holding the shotty by the jakobs stock and being a bada$$.

I’ll take a look at em when I get home

#13

Eh, I’ll try it, but I don’t think I’ll be changing my opinion on 'em.

#14

I am only certain of one thing about Hyperion shotguns:

If you are using CE on Gaige, (and you should be) then jakobs stock is most likely the best option.

On all other characters, the torgue stock is accepted as the “best” because of how it seemed to have tested out.

Its been a long time since I have studied any of the old guides, but I think the findings had shown that spread had a major factor in it.

#15

Unhelpful video will be loaded momentarily.

I tested 3 Company Men (For the uninitiated this is Essentially a Thinking with a 30 Mag) with a Blank Nisha.

Some Notes:

As Far as Initial Circle Size (Idk what this was to be attributed to): Jakobs bigger than Torgue and Hyp

Shots to Hit Min Circle: Hyp and Torgue took about 1 Less Shot to Hit Min Accuracy than Jakobs

Time to Blow Back to Min Acc. : Torgue took the Longest followed by Jakobs then Hyp (Difference being a bit less than 1s each)Edit: Corrected now I’m not tired Hyp and Jakobs bloomed to full slower than Torgue but the difference between Jakobs and Hyp were basically unnoticeable.

Smallest Circle Size : Might be Jakobs but I can’t really tell for sure

[Rough] Idea of Spreads: Hyp and Torgue were about the same, but Jakobs was consistently more vertical. (I didn’t test in the video but the pellets roughly formed a rectangle, the Jakobs one was a taller rectangle than the Torgue and Hyp).

Overall not that different, but in practice the Jakobs stock didn’t look as good as the other Two (which more or less looked the same in most aspects)

Granted this is TPS (which should be applicable to BL2 but it might not be) so take heed of caution.

1 Like
#16

In all honesty the reason I use the Hyperion stock is b/c its the one I grew accustomed to after being told over and over again that it was the best. And I use it on Hyperion SGs b/c of personal preference after some bootleg test I did in the beginning of my Borderlands career. (And in general this stuff is too convoluted, and effects the gun to little to be worth my time. But I love it when guys like you @Chuck80 do this kind of stuff <3.)

So in short I’ve grown attached to how the stocks I use now look. I.E. Even if I am using an IVF I’ll still get one with a Dahl stock b/c it doesn’t feel right w/out it.

The stocks I use

General use

  • SMGs - Dahl
  • Snipers - Dahl (except Vladof, I use a matching stock)
  • Shotguns - Hyperion
  • Launcher - Torgue
  • ARs - Dahl
  • Lasers - Matching manufacture

Non-Min/Max play

  • Snipers - no Jacobs
  • ARs - no Jacobs

Speed kills

  • All bets are off :stuck_out_tongue:
#17

I thought you had my old gbx thread about Hyperion Recoil saved?

#19

It’s close between Hyp and Jakobs but it has been corrected.

Twas Tired and I wroteded wrong.

Regardless i think we’ve accomplished to reiterate that the Jakobs stock is indeed bad.

3 Likes
#21

Soo this matters to none of you in BL2 land but since this is about Hyp Stocks I want to add that Old Hyperion Shotguns from TPS have almost no benefit from the Torgue Stock because its max and min accuracy circles are exactly the same with em. The faster time to hit min doesnt matter when the accuracy doesn’t shrink to begin with.

Also I’m sure this was established at some point but Hyp Stocks appears to be objectively superior in any case where max-to-min shrinkage occurs in the same number of shots.

1 Like
#22

Seems that I was wrong.

As @benwest93 pointed out, when it comes to Hyperion shotguns “reduced recoil” will increase the speed at which the reticle will close, and “faster recoil recovery” will make blooming out slower (so I guess we could say that the positive aspects stay positive) Which makes my whole premises here false.

With that in mind, the Hyperion grip appears the best in most cases, but since “reduced recoil” will have dual benefit of making the gun less jump AND making the reticle close faster, it should be considered a prime choice of characteristics, especially for those guns that have a short mag and could benefit from being accurate more quickly. The Torgue stock does get accurate quicker but it also loses all of that more quickly too (which on short mag guns also means that they will reload more often too).

Wouldn’t the Tediore stock be superior to the Torgue in those cases then ?

1 Like
#23

I thought I did… I don’t know where it is. I’m trying to find it :frowning: